wood cat

kate_nepveu


incidents and accidents, hints and allegations



Thanks.

Thank you for providing the content of the blogs. Some people have missed the whole thing and are still interested in reading it.

(Deleted comment)
That's what it's for, linking and reference.

thanks! found a link to this on a friend's journal, and it's pretty much made my mind up: my life will do just fine, without bothering to read this silly woman's novels. She hates fanfic, fine, I'm'a dis her right back.

so be it!

loved the great big list of all the published works that are purely fanfic; grrrrreat!

Thanks--I'd missed the last two additions.

Thank you! Linking back!


So, I understand the impulse toward archival, but... I mean, if she decided to take her posts down, isn't that a decision that she has a right to make? I mean, it'd be one thing if she were an evil, toxic person and preserving this record of perfidy against her will was important against her attempt to whitewash history, but I don't think that's the case here, is it?

Straw man much?

If someone said something foolish at a con panel, would you support them trying to get all accurate quotes of their statements removed from con reports, videos of the panel removed from YouTube, etc.?

What she said is newsworthy. I can (and do) like her books and not think she's an evil toxic person, while _at the same time_ thinking that she does not have the right to pretend that what she said never happened.

If she's taken them down because she had changed her mind, or because Blogger wouldn't allow her to disable comments without deleting the posts--which I don't think is the case-or if she'd offered some other explanation for deleting, the case might be different. I'm honestly not sure. But it's not.

I'm not straw-manning, I'm saying that unless there are very exceptional circumstances, I'd work on the general principle that people own their words and can legitimately decide not to publish them (or, to the extent it's possible, unpublish them once published) if they want.

People can, of course, decide not to publish, but unpublishing? That's not anything that is guaranteed by the principles dictating that people own their words, IMNSHO. You own what you say, so you'd best be damned careful what you say and how you say it, because you can't unsay it.

I just wanted to mention that I think both sides have points, although ultimately I support kate_nepveu *. Diana Gabaldon has the right to delete a post, the same way I have the right to delete one of my fics if I think it's too old and embarrassing, or want to leave ff.net, or whatever. ;)

However, she did write it, and she did post it, and if someone copies and pastes it, or posts it to -their- blog or site, then that's their right, as long as it's properly credited. So thanks for doing so!

*Sorry, idk how to make LJ do it's linky name thing... I'm a total noob, can't you tell? :)

Unholy Thread Necromancy, Batman!

I can tell, actually!

Excuse me, I thought by "an evil, toxic person" and "perfidy" you were edging up on Godwin's Law.

I assure you that I did consider what I was doing and I decided that since speech is action, to restate my prior comment more briefly, it was appropriate. I respect your disagreement.

An accurate record of what actually happened is better than to have none of it---for all parties involved, including Diana.

After all, it's not like the rest of the discussion (which now spans Fandom Wank, a whole lot of LiveJournal posts, many unsympathetic but a few very sympathetic from Big Folks like GRRM, Whatever, io9, plenty of blogs outside of LiveJournal, Twitter, etc) is going to go away.

If her words are gone, all that's left for people who want to learn about this is the impressions of others. This is likely not fair to Diana in the end. (Indeed, self bahleetion just makes people assume even more unsavory things about the original words than were there in the first place.)

You speak the truth here, my friend.

Thank you for this.

I passed your link to Fandom Wank. Someone has also managed to take "freeze pages" of all the comments (http://www.journalfen.net/community/fandom_wank/1246633.html?thread=214081961#t214081961) (although up until what point, I do not know), though that's not been linked in the main entry yet.

That link has the first three pages of comments to the first post Gabaldon made, which I hadn't been able to find elsewhere. I also have the second page of comments to the second post, and the first page of comments to the third post. I also have the contents of her fourth post.

As you can see, I'm trying to get all the comments back! :) If anyone wants what I have, I will gladly share. Similarly, if someone has something I didn't list in the paragraph above, I'd love to get it. ♥

Edited to add more information

Edited at 2010-05-11 10:30 pm (UTC)

I hadn't seen the last two, so thank you for the record.

Oh hey, I missed her "apology" when it was up - thanks for this.

ot

Would you mind terribly if I friended you?

Re: ot

Open friending & defriending any day here, no need to ask.

Thanks for archiving her blog posts. But I have to admit that I've lost all respect for this author even_before_her hissy fit when she posted in a previous blog that she would be publishing "offensive letters" that she had received and her responses to them in her upcoming Outlander Companion II. I left a comment at her blog, saying that it would be very inappropriate for her to publish said "offensive letters" in her book without considering the feelings of those people who had written these letters. Having been once a member of the forum where she frequents, "offensive" usually means topics/opinions that she and her diehard fans deem "offensive" (this would include any discussions on any "slash" scenarios between her characters, fanfics, etc.).

I really, truly hope that she would not take her diatribe over into that book. As much as I love her books, my interest in them is gradually diminishing because of her offensive attitude.

Here via metafandom, rather late, and I'm sorry I didn't get here before.

There's a wonderful book called "The Flight of the Heron." It's set during the 1745 rebellion, and is the story of a friendship between a tall, red-haired Highland chieftain and a captured English officer. There's a female love interest too, and a hint of the supernatural... And it was written in 1925.

There's an article here:

http://www.collectingbooksandmagazines.com/broster.html

which covers it, and the author's other works, in some detail - though it includes massive spoilers. The article's author points out the parallels between FotH and the Outlander series, and points out that DG cites it in "Through the Stones."

Which kind of puts a whole new slant on DG's attitude to fanfic, doesn't it?

More Authors Who Think Fanfic Is Teh Evil

User kayay referenced to your post from More Authors Who Think Fanfic Is Teh Evil saying: [...] ns please not write it, but they frothing foamingly despise it with a passion, and anyone who writes it is one of the lowest forms of reprehensible life out there. I'm not exaggerating.

Last month author Diana Gabaldon -- whom I'd not heard of before -- created a kerfuffle by comparing writing fanfic to breaking into someone's house,

Well, see, this is where “illegal” comes in. You can’t break into somebody’s house, even if you don’t mean to steal anything. You can’t camp in someone’s backyard without permission, even if you aren’t raising a marijuana crop back there. [1] [...]

When you're messing with my characters, you're messing with me...

By this logic I shouldn't be allowed to write a story about Odysseus or Priam or Iphigenia and the Trojan War because these things not only belong to Homer, they are a /part/ of Homer.

Maybe the politest rule is to say "No fanfiction till the author has passed on."




She did say that it was okay to write using the characters of long deceased authors. It is no longer illegal and the author is not there to be made uncomfortable by people causing her creations to act in ways that they wouldn't or confusing followers of her work by adding elements to the story that don't belong.

Kate, would you mind if I cite this post and your screencaps in a paper I'm writing about fic and ethics?

Course not, that's what it's for, a reference.

Thanks! (I'm just making sure I ask for every LJ and fandom citation I make, as this is my first foray into scholarly writing on fandom, and I'd rather err on the side of caution when it comes to permission to cite.)

I think

Its fine if a writer doesn't want someone to write fan fiction, after all why would the fan fiction people complain it's not really their choice since they don't own it. I wouldn't be ok with people writing about my characters either.

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